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Pilot's Mess [chit-chat zone]

This is the forum to get to know your fellow pilots and the ONLY place to talk about everything else not really relevant to sci-fi movies, including your personal loves and interests. A true pilot doesn't discuss these issues while on duty.

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Old Mar 8, 2005, 10:42 AM   #1
SF_not_Sci-Fi
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Thumbs up DON'T support the troops!

(taken from
http://www.americanfreepress.net/htm...esistance.html

WAR TAX RESISTANCE GROWS



50¢ of Every Tax Dollar Goes to Pay for Wars; Large Numbers of
Americans Refusing to Pony Up

By John Tiffany

Increasing numbers of Americans say the U.S. government is involved
in immoral and illegal wars around the world and are refusing to
support this
with their tax money. The invasion and occupation of Iraq and
Afghanistan and the indiscriminate killing of civilians, for example,
are outlawed by
international law.

“Of every tax dollar paid, more than 50 cents goes to pay for past,
present and future military expenses. The military budget for the
Department of Defense alone for 2005 will be close to $500 billion.
Our payment of federal taxes enables the government to carry on a
continuing program of illegal military activities,” wrote Glen
Milner, a member of Ground Zero Center for Nonviolent Action in
Poulsbo, Wash., in a recent opinion piece in The Seattle
Post-Intelligencer.

“International laws and agreements support and encourage citizens
to resist their government when it is engaged in illegal acts,”
Milner added.

Under international laws, those who facilitate illegal wars and war
crimes could actually be morally—if not legally—accountable, say
proponents of resisting war taxes. Principle IV of the Nuremberg
Principles states: “The fact that a person acted pursuant to order
of his government or of a superior does not relieve him from
responsibility under international law, provided a moral choice was
in fact possible to him.”

For example, a 1996 ruling by the International Court of Justice
regarding the threat or use of nuclear weapons could be interpreted
to mean that the United States’ deployment of depleted uranium
weapons is illegal. The humanitarian measure prohibits the use of
weapons or methods of warfare
that are directed against civilians or cannot discriminate between
military targets and civilians; cause unnecessary suffering to
combatants; violate the territory of neutral states; cause long-term
and widespread damage to the environment or use poisonous substances.

Most war tax resisters redirect their withheld federal tax funds to
outfits such as the Conscience and Military Tax Campaign Escrow
Account in Seattle. This way, the money is still on hand, if they
should ever be forced to fork it over. Though getting a notice from
the Internal Revenue Service is likely, jail is uncommon for war tax
resisters. Still, there are no guarantees.

IRS public affairs officer Ken Vargas of the Austin, Texas, office of
the IRS explains the collections office sends out “soft notices”
first, followed by “harder notices” later. Vargas says the IRS
doesn’t keep a handy record of war tax resisters. He insists
“normal collection procedures” apply to all subjects, regardless
of whether they write letters stating their war tax resistance. In
fact, the tax reform act of 1998 makes it illegal for the IRS to
designate tax protesters as a special class.

Susan Quinlan, a Bay Area organizer for the National War Tax
Resistance Coordinating Committee, pegs the number of war tax
resisters who have seriously faced jail time at less than 20 over the
past 50 years. It doesn’t necessarily have to be your income tax
that you use for protesting, either.

One of the first federal taxes to spark opposition was the federal
phone tax. This tax has been in existence since 1914. Originally
introduced as a “temporary” tax, after 76 years Congress made it
permanent and set its level at 3 percent of your phone bill.
Protesters simply include a note saying that they refuse to pay their
federal excise tax for conscientious purposes and pay the rest.

Resistance to the telephone tax has a long and distinguished history,
and most phone companies will put up no fight to customers who will
not pay it. Perhaps they’re just as happy not to serve as unpaid
tax collectors for the feds.

In any event, tax resister groups estimate that tens of thousands of
Americans don’t pay their income taxes in order to protest
U.S.-backed war efforts around the world. And, they say, that number
is growing every year.




Not Copyrighted. Readers can reprint and are free to redistribute -
as long as full credit is given to American Free Press - 645
Pennsylvania Avenue SE, Suite 100 Washington, D.C. 20003
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Old Mar 8, 2005, 02:05 PM   #2
JACKER
The Paradisal Man
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1,359 flights since Dec 2001
Location: Either in the gutter or the clouds
Re: DON'T support the troops!

Some say that knowledge is power, but I say knowledge is helplessness. To be aware, is to realize the full extent of your own inadequacy. But yeah, so if we can cut the government off, then they cannot fund their war?
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Old Mar 8, 2005, 06:39 PM   #3
SF_not_Sci-Fi
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Re: DON'T support the troops!

Yes. And they will have a domestic war of conquest on their hands in order to enforce the tax code.
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Old Mar 8, 2005, 07:05 PM   #4
JACKER
The Paradisal Man
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1,359 flights since Dec 2001
Location: Either in the gutter or the clouds
Re: DON'T support the troops!

Call me old fashioned, but I prefer my taxes to go to useful things. I believe and understand the civic duty we all have to function as a society, but please, no stupid wars.
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Old Mar 8, 2005, 08:58 PM   #5
oneuglymotherf***er
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Re: DON'T support the troops!

Supporting the war and supporting the troops are two seprate things. When you say "Dont support the troops" in my mind youre saying "Leave them to rot and die."
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Old Mar 8, 2005, 09:17 PM   #6
SF_not_Sci-Fi
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Re: DON'T support the troops!

Please read the post before responding to it, ****er. I noticed that you sometimes think that there is no information in posts beyond the title. By 'support' I mean financial support. How can one claim to oppose a war while willfully funding it out of one's own pocket?

I sympathize the duped and deuded kids over there. They ought to be freed from their endenture and given transportation home. You can shove that hypocritical **** about letting them die up your arse. YOU are leaving them to die by funding the war machine that is putting them in harms way. You are not only leaving them to die, you are leaving them to kill as well. If you are the pious little Christian that you claim to be, you should be more worried about their immortal souls.

Support the ****ing troops? Hell, everyone who pays federal taxes does that. You just like to puff out your chest and post about it on internet forums.

Last edited by SF_not_Sci-Fi : Mar 8, 2005 at 09:22 PM.
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Old Mar 8, 2005, 09:18 PM   #7
Drone
Sector Marshall
584 flights since Jun 2002
Re: DON'T support the troops!

Now, let us sit and wait for another *****ic reply.
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Old Mar 8, 2005, 09:22 PM   #8
oneuglymotherf***er
n/a flights since
Re: DON'T support the troops!

Please read the post, ****er. By 'support' I mean financial support. How can one claim to oppose a war while willfully funding it out of one's own pocket?
I know i was stating whats on my mind, but apreantly thats not valid, me diagreeing with you and all

I sympathize the duped and deuded kids over there. They ought to be freed from their endenture and given transportation home. You can shove that hypocritical **** about letting them die up your arse. YOU are leaving them to die by funding the war machine that is putting them in harms way.

Ya know im getting sick and ****ing tired of you ragging on me becouse of my opinon and all. I want them back to. I dont like war, but its what has to be done. I have a close friend in iraq he came back on leave for a week and i tell you what, according to him, things arent as bad as you make it seem.
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Old Mar 8, 2005, 09:23 PM   #9
Drone
Sector Marshall
584 flights since Jun 2002
Re: DON'T support the troops!

Quote:
Originally posted by oneuglymotherf***er
Please read the post, ****er. By 'support' I mean financial support. How can one claim to oppose a war while willfully funding it out of one's own pocket?
I know i was stating whats on my mind, but apreantly thats not valid, me diagreeing with you and all

I sympathize the duped and deuded kids over there. They ought to be freed from their endenture and given transportation home. You can shove that hypocritical **** about letting them die up your arse. YOU are leaving them to die by funding the war machine that is putting them in harms way.

Ya know im getting sick and ****ing tired of you ragging on me becouse of my opinon and all. I want them back to. I dont like war, but its what has to be done. I have a close friend in iraq he came back on leave for a week and i tell you what, according to him, things arent as bad as you make it seem.


There it is.
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Old Mar 8, 2005, 09:27 PM   #10
oneuglymotherf***er
n/a flights since
Re: DON'T support the troops!

How sad that becouse a post disagrees with you it becomes non-valied.
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Old Mar 8, 2005, 09:36 PM   #11
SF_not_Sci-Fi
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Re: DON'T support the troops!

Quote:
Originally posted by oneuglymotherf***er


Ya know im getting sick and ****ing tired of you ragging on me becouse of my opinon and all. I want them back to. I dont like war, but its what has to be done. I have a close friend in iraq he came back on leave for a week and i tell you what, according to him, things arent as bad as you make it seem.
I'm ragging on you? No, ugly... I'm actually just DISAGREEING with you. If you can't handle that, then I suggest that you go back to beating on that strawman that you brought out in the last post. 'What has to be done?' For whom? The Iraqi people? They want us out. How badly do I make it seem? worse than the over 100,000 civilians murdered by the occupation? Worse then a war the justification of which has changed so many times that most Americans have lost track? Worse than the actual lies, corruption, carnage and the scary neo-facsist adgenda of the administration?

Doesn't it bother you that 50% of your tax dollars pay for the execution and consequences of wars waged by the US government?
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Old Mar 8, 2005, 09:47 PM   #12
Unregistered
n/a flights since
Re: DON'T support the troops!

I'm ragging on you? No, ugly... I'm actually just DISAGREEING with you.
You can always do that in a cilvalived manner, when i say that i mean not getting pissy.



They want us out.
Strange acording to My friend, Joey, they didnt seem as angry as you said.

How badly do I make it seem?
Worse than it is.

Worse then a war the justification of which has changed so many times that most Americans have lost track?
When? When has it changed, get me writen proff that the justifiacation of this war has changed so many times.


Worse than the actual lies, corruption, carnage and the scary neo-facsist adgenda of the administration?
Facist? Facisist what did Bush and the other evil scumbag republicans wake up one day and say:
"Lets go kill, rape, and pilage Iraq"? The "lies corruption and carnage" line was old when i heared it. The lies part is for lack of a beeter term Bullcrap Bush neve lied.
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Old Mar 8, 2005, 10:27 PM   #13
SF_not_Sci-Fi
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2,877 flights since Nov 2001
Re: DON'T support the troops!

Quote:
Originally posted by Unregistered
When? When has it changed, get me writen proff that the justifiacation of this war has changed so many times.
First it was over supposed ties between Iraq and Al Quaida. No link was found. Then it was WMD's. None were found. Now it's 'liberation.' That line was old when Hitler used it. Were you just not paying attention for the past three years, or is this just a case of 'into the memory hole?'
Quote:
Strange acording to My friend, Joey, they didnt seem as angry as you said.
The testomonies of Iraqis and many American soldiers contradict this.
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Old Mar 8, 2005, 10:43 PM   #14
SF_not_Sci-Fi
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2,877 flights since Nov 2001
Re: DON'T support the troops!

And I have no delusions about the fact that I will never make you see the light. This is not the point of the thread. Read my original post for some perspective.

Riddle me this, mother****er: If the US government were fighting a war that you considered an unjust and murderous war of agression, would you consider not paying taxes? And if you would continue to pay taxes, how would this be different from giving money to a terrorist group? Remember: Hamas spends a much greater percentage of its resources on 'human services' then the US government does. HAMAS's military spending is nowhere near 50% of its budget.

Last edited by SF_not_Sci-Fi : Mar 9, 2005 at 12:22 AM.
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Old Mar 8, 2005, 11:12 PM   #15
JACKER
The Paradisal Man
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1,359 flights since Dec 2001
Location: Either in the gutter or the clouds
Re: DON'T support the troops!

Any caffeine this evening, SF?
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